Discussion:
Question about APL ATF files
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Hans Seehase
2008-01-28 03:09:50 UTC
Permalink
Oops, forgot the ATF part in my prior append.

It is possible from a runtime program to generate ATF files (at least by
using the KEEP function in AGSS). In general, how are ATF files treated for
distribution (sharing) among runtime file users since they may occasionally
include code material from APL libraries (if that's used to aid in
performing certain program tasks). E. g. use delta FM to save to a text file
(without having to roll your own file saving program).

Hans Seehase
Nancy Wheeler
2008-01-28 18:55:52 UTC
Permalink
The APL2 runtime library is intended for running closed APL2
applications. Applications that run on the Runtime Library must be
started from namespaces or workspaces packaged in DLL's. APL2 Runtime
users are by definition users of a specific application or applications,
not direct users of APL2, so they themselves should have no need to
share, use or examine .atf files. If there are .atf files that are
"side files" to a runtime application, i.e. shipped with or generated by
the applcation, those .atf files must not contain any proprietary IBM code.

Nancy Wheeler
APL Products and Services
Post by Hans Seehase
Oops, forgot the ATF part in my prior append.
It is possible from a runtime program to generate ATF files (at least by
using the KEEP function in AGSS). In general, how are ATF files treated for
distribution (sharing) among runtime file users since they may occasionally
include code material from APL libraries (if that's used to aid in
performing certain program tasks). E. g. use delta FM to save to a text file
(without having to roll your own file saving program).
Hans Seehase
Hans Seehase
2008-01-29 04:54:05 UTC
Permalink
Nancy,

ATF files can be handled under runtime control by way of APL library files?
And the latter can be included in the runtime program per the license text,
which should satisfy the lawyers? Therefore, there would be many instances
where users may want to use that feature of sharing ATF type files with
runtime applications. This would not be for the purpose of swiping IBM APL
code. Whether or not IBM APL code is exposed is not really controllable
anyway and would be incidental and probably irrelevant to most people who
can't do anything with it because they don't own the program product anyway.
Shouldn't you want to stimulate interest in APL - see my prior append with
regard to the model provided by J.

Hans
The APL2 runtime library is intended for running closed APL2 applications.
Applications that run on the Runtime Library must be started from
namespaces or workspaces packaged in DLL's. APL2 Runtime users are by
definition users of a specific application or applications, not direct
users of APL2, so they themselves should have no need to share, use or
examine .atf files. If there are .atf files that are "side files" to a
runtime application, i.e. shipped with or generated by the applcation,
those .atf files must not contain any proprietary IBM code.
Nancy Wheeler
APL Products and Services
Post by Hans Seehase
Oops, forgot the ATF part in my prior append.
It is possible from a runtime program to generate ATF files (at least by
using the KEEP function in AGSS). In general, how are ATF files treated
for distribution (sharing) among runtime file users since they may
occasionally include code material from APL libraries (if that's used to
aid in performing certain program tasks). E. g. use delta FM to save to a
text file (without having to roll your own file saving program).
Hans Seehase
Nancy Wheeler
2008-01-30 00:57:52 UTC
Permalink
Hans,

I am not sure which parts of your append is question and which part is
statement, but...

)IN and )OUT, along with many other system commends, are disabled in the
APL2 Runtime Library. The intent is that a user with only the APL2
Runtime Library installed may run applications written in APL2, that are
already packaged and provided by others, but he/she may not use it to
examine or develop APL2 code.

What I meant to imply was that writers of applications that will be
deployed on the APL2 Runtime, if they were motivated to do so, could
conceivably make use of .atf files in their applications by using a
combination of file I/O, QuadFX and QuadTF. If they wanted to ship .atf
files with their application, or generate them as part of their
application's execution, there is nothing the APL2 Runtime license that
prevents them from doing so <as long as the .atf file that is shipped or
generated does not contain any IBM-copyrighted code>.

Under normal conditions, it would seem like most application writers
would be just as interested in protecting their code as we are in
protecting ours, and thus .atf files would not be their preferred
distribution medium. But I guess there are always exceptions.

Stimulating interest in APL is of course a laudable goal. But that is
not what the APL2 Runtime is intended for.

Nancy Wheeler
APL Products and Services
Post by Hans Seehase
Nancy,
ATF files can be handled under runtime control by way of APL library files?
And the latter can be included in the runtime program per the license text,
which should satisfy the lawyers? Therefore, there would be many instances
where users may want to use that feature of sharing ATF type files with
runtime applications. This would not be for the purpose of swiping IBM APL
code. Whether or not IBM APL code is exposed is not really controllable
anyway and would be incidental and probably irrelevant to most people who
can't do anything with it because they don't own the program product anyway.
Shouldn't you want to stimulate interest in APL - see my prior append with
regard to the model provided by J.
Hans
The APL2 runtime library is intended for running closed APL2 applications.
Applications that run on the Runtime Library must be started from
namespaces or workspaces packaged in DLL's. APL2 Runtime users are by
definition users of a specific application or applications, not direct
users of APL2, so they themselves should have no need to share, use or
examine .atf files. If there are .atf files that are "side files" to a
runtime application, i.e. shipped with or generated by the applcation,
those .atf files must not contain any proprietary IBM code.
Nancy Wheeler
APL Products and Services
Post by Hans Seehase
Oops, forgot the ATF part in my prior append.
It is possible from a runtime program to generate ATF files (at least by
using the KEEP function in AGSS). In general, how are ATF files treated
for distribution (sharing) among runtime file users since they may
occasionally include code material from APL libraries (if that's used to
aid in performing certain program tasks). E. g. use delta FM to save to a
text file (without having to roll your own file saving program).
Hans Seehase
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